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Thread: So, guys, I have engaged in Intermittent Fasting.

  1. #1
    Steroidal.com Writer/Mod Dan C's Avatar
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    So, guys, I have engaged in Intermittent Fasting.

    I've been trying to lean out for the last 6 weeks or so with standard results using the traditional 500 calorie deficit. Results were slowing down, so I dropped it to an 800 calorie deficit. No strength loss what so ever at all, which means no muscle loss. But fat loss seems to be at a grind, even after a weekend re-feed.

    After doing some considerable reading on IF (Intermittent Fasting), I decided to give it a go. Today was my first day at it. Here is what I am doing: 18 hours fasting period with 6 - 8 hour feed period. I'm simply taking all of the food and caloric intake I am currently engaging in (which is still the 500 - 800 caloric deficit I mentioned) and simply shift all of it into 3 meals during the 6 - 8 hour feed period. ALL FOOD IS STILL 100% CLEAN!!!! Too many people, as usual, think that they can do Intermittent Fasting and just eat whatever they want and/or not count calories when the feed period comes along and still make progress. NO!!! My schedule is as follows:

    NON-WORKOUT DAYS

    3:30pm (15:30 hours): first meal

    6:00pm (18:00 hours): second meal

    9:00pm (21:00 hours): third meal, and last meal before the fast

    9:00pm (21:00 hours): 3:30pm (15:30 hours) is the 18 hour fasting period

    WORKOUT DAYS

    2:15pm (14:15 hours): 10g BCAA before the workout

    2:30pm (14:30 hours) - 3:30pm (15:30 hours): workout

    3:30pm (15:30 hours) - 4:00 (16:00 hours): first meal / post-workout meal

    9:00pm (21:00 hours): third meal, and last meal before the fast

    Due to rare scheduling circumstances, tomorrow my workout is going to be shifted into the early morning rather than the afternoon, but I will STILL be consuming my first meal at 3:30pm. This will involve 10g of BCAAs consumed every hour or two until I hit the 3:30pm meal in order to stave off catabolism. In any case, today was my first day doing IF and I felt a bit hungry throughout the fasting hours but I was not tearing the walls down. Its not so bad actually. I was really dreading the hunger that might manifest but it was not that bad. I think much of the hunger that people might get is all psychological. Make no mistake, I was hungry, but it's not as bad as I thought it might be. I find that also keeping occupied with your activities such as school, work, etc. works very well (again, going back to the fact that it is likely mostly psychological as we are used to eating so frequently). What I am dreading, however, is working out in a fasted state tomorrow... but it might not be as bad as I expect.

    I will definitely say that doing IF seems acceptable for leaning out, but I will say this: I cannot see myself doing this for bulking. When I achieve my goals with this, I am going right back to eating 6 times per day, eating every meal every 3 hours. I'm sure one could bulk on IF, but I just cannot see myself consuming 3,500+ calories while bulking up 3 meals. I couldn't stomach that. I'm cutting on a deficit right now, and in my 3:30pm meal, I am consuming 100g of protein in that one meal alone! That's about 260g (9 ounces) of lean chicken/turkey, and that's not including the carbs and the leafy greens I have to eat in that one meal too. Imagine what you'd have to eat per meal while bulking up. No thanks. But for cutting, this seems ideal.

    Lets see how this goes from here on out...
    Sofie likes this.

  2. #2
    Founding Member TroN's Avatar
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    Are you on any aas at the moment?

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    Steroidal.com Writer/Mod Dan C's Avatar
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    None. Peptides are the only assistance right now.

  4. #4
    Founding Member TroN's Avatar
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    I did the exact same thing awhile back. Ran peptides during fasting and preworkout. I leaned out pretty good for the short time I was on it. BUT I did lose lbm during the course of it, but didn't realize it till after I stopped and went back and reviewed progress. Another BUT lol I had natural test levels in low 300's.

  5. #5
    Founding Member TroN's Avatar
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    I may try it again with assistance of aas tho

  6. #6
    Steroidal.com Writer/Mod Dan C's Avatar
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    Testosterone in the 300s! That is a huge BUT! Anyone could lose LBM on any diet with levels right at the border of the low end of normal.

    I don't see myself losing muscle as long as I get my required calories in during my feed period. I also engage in Mentzer style HIT routines, so with the low volume training, I don't see myself performing so many sets that it would severely deplete glycogen or destroy enough muscle that would cause the fasting periods to catabolize muscle, especially if I use the BCAAs.

  7. #7
    Founding Member TroN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan C View Post
    Testosterone in the 300s! That is a huge BUT! Anyone could lose LBM on any diet with levels right at the border of the low end of normal.

    I don't see myself losing muscle as long as I get my required calories in during my feed period. I also engage in Mentzer style HIT routines, so with the low volume training, I don't see myself performing so many sets that it would severely deplete glycogen or destroy enough muscle that would cause the fasting periods to catabolize muscle, especially if I use the BCAAs.
    Haha yeah, hence the cruise and blast I just started. Tired I this see saw bullshit. Dr's wouldn't do anything cuz of my age and it wasn't below the threshold.

    But yeah just sharing my experience with it. It did drop fat quite fast tho. The first week is a bitch lol

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    VET warmouth's Avatar
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    Wow. Most people I know use the 16 hour fast. 18 should benefit you well. I can tell you this Dan, and I know you know this from experience, but keep glucose tabs on hand during the fast. I know you have experienced hypoglycemic episodes in the past, but I am posting this for others to read as well. When you have a hypoglycemic episode, it is very scary. It is even dangerous if you are driving or doing anything that requires thought. I once got lost only 5 minutes away from my house and drove around crying for what seemed to be 2 hours. Nothing looked familiar. I had a terible panic attack (not prone and was the first). When I finally got home, I got out of my truck and my body was pins and needles (like sitting on your leg for several minutes, only throughtout my body) and I fell to the gound trembling. It was the only time I felt as if doom was nearing and a feeling dread I cant even explain.
    I know this is extreme, but if blood sugar levels drop, and no food is near, it can lead to dangerous things. This is an extreme case, I know, but for anyone wanting to try IF and dont know how they function fasting, it is wise to keep simple sugars on hand until you have learned your bodys response. Just food for thought. Not aimed at you Dan because I know you know your body. Good luck with the new diet and keep us posted.

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    Great me too.... I hate ittttt

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    Founding Member Mini-G's Avatar
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    800 calorie deficit. That's intense. Considering it takes 3500 calories to lose 1lb of fat I don't know how weightloss could slow? The body follows the same regime as functions as long as you keep a deficit going? My weightloss only ever slows when I find myself eating Reese's pieces for breakfast. Hahaha.

    You're one of the few people I trust and take advice from so I know you know what you're doing going even further. Keep us updated!!! Start an actual diet thread with all your info and reiterate your battle plan so I can follow it! How do you subscribe on this anyway?

  11. #11
    Steroidal.com Writer/Mod Dan C's Avatar
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    Alright, so I completed my second day of IF, and today I performed my workout in fasted state. I hit the gym at 1:00pm, after consuming 10g of BCAAs prior. I felt no hypoglycemic episodes, and no weakness during the workout. I completed all sets to expectations and there was really no loss in strength. I even completed my 365 lb. deadlifts and actually went up in strength from last back day, I achieved 1 rep higher than last. I know 1 rep does not sound like a lot in terms of strength gains, but when you are on a deficit trying to lose fat, it is pretty significant.

    Completed my workout at 2:00pm and I had to be somewhere for 3:00, so I had no time to head right home and eat. This is the benefit of IF - I don't need to pack all my meals beforehand since all my food consumption is in the evening, pretty much after all errands/work/school is finished earlier in the day. So, I took another 10g BCAAs at 2:30pm and after I took care of what I needed to do, I got home at 4:00pm and ate my first meal. It's about 50 minutes since I ate, and i'll be eating again in another hour and a bit or so. I feel pretty good so far, no giant loss in energy during the fasting periods, no weakness either, no hypoglycemia. Day 2 of IF was not bad.
    I'm liking the BCAAs 15 minutes before working out, it seems to keep things normal when training in a fasted state.

    Quote Originally Posted by warmouth View Post
    Wow. Most people I know use the 16 hour fast. 18 should benefit you well. I can tell you this Dan, and I know you know this from experience, but keep glucose tabs on hand during the fast. I know you have experienced hypoglycemic episodes in the past, but I am posting this for others to read as well. When you have a hypoglycemic episode, it is very scary. It is even dangerous if you are driving or doing anything that requires thought. I once got lost only 5 minutes away from my house and drove around crying for what seemed to be 2 hours. Nothing looked familiar. I had a terible panic attack (not prone and was the first). When I finally got home, I got out of my truck and my body was pins and needles (like sitting on your leg for several minutes, only throughtout my body) and I fell to the gound trembling. It was the only time I felt as if doom was nearing and a feeling dread I cant even explain.
    I know this is extreme, but if blood sugar levels drop, and no food is near, it can lead to dangerous things. This is an extreme case, I know, but for anyone wanting to try IF and dont know how they function fasting, it is wise to keep simple sugars on hand until you have learned your bodys response. Just food for thought. Not aimed at you Dan because I know you know your body. Good luck with the new diet and keep us posted.
    Hypoglycemia has really never been an issue for me, but I am aware that during fasting periods it is more likely to happen, so I do keep some candy or some quick sugars on hand just in case. It's a good idea.

    Quote Originally Posted by Mini-G View Post
    800 calorie deficit. That's intense. Considering it takes 3500 calories to lose 1lb of fat I don't know how weightloss could slow? The body follows the same regime as functions as long as you keep a deficit going? My weightloss only ever slows when I find myself eating Reese's pieces for breakfast. Hahaha.

    You're one of the few people I trust and take advice from so I know you know what you're doing going even further. Keep us updated!!! Start an actual diet thread with all your info and reiterate your battle plan so I can follow it! How do you subscribe on this anyway?
    My body has been strange with deficits. You'd think fat loss wouldn't slow down as long as the deficit remains the same, and generally most people's physiology will not undergo metabolic slowdown until 3 months into a deficit. I don't know what's going on with me here, lol.

  12. #12
    Steroidal.com Writer/Mod Dan C's Avatar
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    ALRIGHT!!!! Day 3 of IF and it's a Sunday today, not much to do, just hanging around the house and therefore not occupied enough to keep my mind off food and my appetite during this fasting period. The hunger has been getting to me quite a bit this morning, and I think my workout yesterday has really kicked the metabolism into high gear today, so, I have pulled out the heavy artillery:

    Ephedrine and Caffeine stack. 32mg Ephedrine, 200mg Caffeine taken about 20 minutes ago. Kicking in now.

    The EC stack is one of the only things that completely destroys my appetite. I have no choice at this point, the hunger has been getting to me quite a bit. This should also assist fat oxidation in a fasted state a well.

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    Founding Member TroN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan C View Post
    ALRIGHT!!!! Day 3 of IF and it's a Sunday today, not much to do, just hanging around the house and therefore not occupied enough to keep my mind off food and my appetite during this fasting period. The hunger has been getting to me quite a bit this morning, and I think my workout yesterday has really kicked the metabolism into high gear today, so, I have pulled out the heavy artillery:

    Ephedrine and Caffeine stack. 32mg Ephedrine, 200mg Caffeine taken about 20 minutes ago. Kicking in now.

    The EC stack is one of the only things that completely destroys my appetite. I have no choice at this point, the hunger has been getting to me quite a bit. This should also assist fat oxidation in a fasted state a well.
    something that i would use while i was doing it and fighting hungar pains is the REDLINE energy drink. idk if they have it there or not, but its basically electrolytes bcaa's with some other goodies in theres lol like a lil huperzine a, yohimbe, 5-htp and also caffeine.

  14. #14
    Steroidal.com Writer/Mod Dan C's Avatar
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    That sounds like a good blend of things, but I want to stay away from BCAAs unless its pre-workout, or the intake of any solid nutrients during the fasting period (even leafy greens, celery, etc. I am staying away from) because I believe they still exhibit a measure of caloric effect on the body. Either way, the EC stack is working incredibly right now. It has my hunger totally under control and giving me that nice energy boost.

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    Founding Member TroN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan C View Post
    That sounds like a good blend of things, but I want to stay away from BCAAs unless its pre-workout, or the intake of any solid nutrients during the fasting period (even leafy greens, celery, etc. I am staying away from) because I believe they still exhibit a measure of caloric effect on the body. Either way, the EC stack is working incredibly right now. It has my hunger totally under control and giving me that nice energy boost.
    idk how much bcaa's it actually has (proprietary blend bullshit), only thing it gives a value on is caffein (158mg). it is a zero carb drink tho. just thought id throw the option out for ya. i just like it cause it gets me amped without the jittery feeling the eca stack gives me. but sounds like youre almost through the first week, the first week was horrible for me lol

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    VET warmouth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TroN View Post
    something that i would use while i was doing it and fighting hungar pains is the REDLINE energy drink. idk if they have it there or not, but its basically electrolytes bcaa's with some other goodies in theres lol like a lil huperzine a, yohimbe, 5-htp and also caffeine.
    I was on that redline kick for a few weeks. Those things work! I gave my dad one, and he is a former speed addict, and he wanted me to take him to the hopsital. It freaked him out enough to not take another one. It was so funny how much he freaked out.

    The ECA stack kills my appetite as well. I havent used the dose you do though. I do 12.5/100/baby asprin. I did get some Wal-Phed from walgreens yesterday and it has 60mgs of Ephederin HCL (which is alot), maybe 48, but I think 60. It was so cheap. 7 bucks for 30 tabs. The other stuff that had ony 15-30mgs was over 10 bucks. Problem is, it has something called triobine(something like that) at 2.5mgs. Have no clue if it should be used. This is going to be an interesting log to see how and what all you use to manipulate your appetite.

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    Founding Member Mini-G's Avatar
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    Yeah I kind of noticed your body was a diet hater considering your dosages of T3 back then

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    Steroidal.com Writer/Mod Dan C's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mini-G View Post
    Yeah I kind of noticed your body was a diet hater considering your dosages of T3 back then
    I think that T3 thing is a totally different beast all together. My body's responses to T3 is just very, very strange.

    Well, end of day 3 on IF, and the EC really made a big difference. I am positive that I am already seeing subtle changes, but if subtle changes are happening this quickly then it is definitely a good sign for this program. Lets see how 1 week of doing this goes.

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    Founding Member TroN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan C View Post
    I think that T3 thing is a totally different beast all together. My body's responses to T3 is just very, very strange.

    Well, end of day 3 on IF, and the EC really made a big difference. I am positive that I am already seeing subtle changes, but if subtle changes are happening this quickly then it is definitely a good sign for this program. Lets see how 1 week of doing this goes.
    You don't go back on cycle for quite a while right? Curious what kind of results IF has with a good dose and some t3. What was ur dose of t3? It was like 250 right?

    Speaking of t3, I've got some questions regarding that. I know cortisol is an important hormone for t3 to work. I know hydrocortisone cream work, but application every 2 hours is a pain in the ass. 5-htp increases cortisol indirectly by increasing serotonin, but also increases Prolactin, which strikes a concern for me with the use of npp and tren. If using t3 and supplementing 5-htp, should we go ahead and just use low doses of caber throughout? Or do u have any other ideas, like maybe prednisone?

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    Founding Member kubes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TroN View Post
    idk how much bcaa's it actually has (proprietary blend bullshit), only thing it gives a value on is caffein (158mg). it is a zero carb drink tho. just thought id throw the option out for ya. i just like it cause it gets me amped without the jittery feeling the eca stack gives me. but sounds like youre almost through the first week, the first week was horrible for me lol
    I use the redlines a couple times EW. They work great for a boost in energy and appetite suppressed. Been doing it for years just can't have them every day or they won't work cause you get to used to them

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    Steroidal.com Writer/Mod Dan C's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TroN View Post
    You don't go back on cycle for quite a while right? Curious what kind of results IF has with a good dose and some t3. What was ur dose of t3? It was like 250 right?

    Speaking of t3, I've got some questions regarding that. I know cortisol is an important hormone for t3 to work. I know hydrocortisone cream work, but application every 2 hours is a pain in the ass. 5-htp increases cortisol indirectly by increasing serotonin, but also increases Prolactin, which strikes a concern for me with the use of npp and tren. If using t3 and supplementing 5-htp, should we go ahead and just use low doses of caber throughout? Or do u have any other ideas, like maybe prednisone?
    Some form of Prolactin control such as Cabergoline, Pramipexole, Bromocriptine, etc. Should be used whenever using any 19-nor compounds such as Nandrolone or Trenbolone. If you're using 5-HTP which is an excellent supplement in and of itself, then the Prolactin issue is already solved!

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    Administrator Admin's Avatar
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    Will follow this...

  23. #23
    Founding Member TroN's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan C View Post
    Some form of Prolactin control such as Cabergoline, Pramipexole, Bromocriptine, etc. Should be used whenever using any 19-nor compounds such as Nandrolone or Trenbolone. If you're using 5-HTP which is an excellent supplement in and of itself, then the Prolactin issue is already solved!
    I've never had any issues with Prolactin before with just 19nors, I keep some prami on hand (but thinking about switching to steady dose of caber if I can find it), but was wondering if I should just go ahead and take it if using both. Wasn't sure how much the 5-htp effected Prolactin. I couldn't did any values.

  24. #24
    Steroidal.com Writer/Mod Dan C's Avatar
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    You can always do the "keep it on hand and use it only if issues arise" protocol. The truth is that Prolactin should not be raised to significant levels with 5-HTP, and in the average person it will go up but it can and might rise to significant enough levels to cause issues in some. If that happens, you can always start on the Prolactin antagonist to get it under control. No big deal.

    I also want to report that my 4th day of IF today is going very well and either I am starting to get noticeably leaner in just 4 days and/or I am noticing that intermittent fasting is dropping water from my body and making me look less bloated than the typical 6 meals per day protocol. I am REALLY liking this so far and i'm curious to see what my bodyfat % reading will be on Thursday this week (I measure body fat, weight, etc. on Thursday of every week).

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    Founding Member TroN's Avatar
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    thanks for the info dan. pretty much what i had suspected, just wanted your opinion. i may start to run caber on a low dose weekly, just cuz of what they say about the erections and sex drive, etc. ive never had to run the prami (or any other Prolactin antagonist for that matter).

    im glad your having good results on the diet man. it no doubt works for shedding fat. even with lower t! lol be sure to let us know the readings!

    r u still having good energy levels throughout ur workouts?

    what kind of macro split r u running?

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    VET warmouth's Avatar
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    Great stuff dan. Following for sure.

    Tron, just use the caber for goodness sakes! You will be glad you did! Prami has the same effect for some so you could like it better. However, 1 dose of prami for me and I was sick as a dog. Some prefer it to caber.

  27. #27
    Steroidal.com Writer/Mod Dan C's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TroN View Post
    thanks for the info dan. pretty much what i had suspected, just wanted your opinion. i may start to run caber on a low dose weekly, just cuz of what they say about the erections and sex drive, etc. ive never had to run the prami (or any other Prolactin antagonist for that matter).

    im glad your having good results on the diet man. it no doubt works for shedding fat. even with lower t! lol be sure to let us know the readings!

    r u still having good energy levels throughout ur workouts?

    what kind of macro split r u running?
    Energy levels haven't been a problem during fasted workouts so far. The BCAAs seemed to really help. Tomorrow i'll be hitting legs, so we'll see how that goes.

    I don't really try to intentionally partition my macros up, but when I cut and drop into a caloric deficit, I will reduce protein down to no less than 1g per lb. of body weight. Once that's been reduced and I can reduce it no further, I will cut carbs down which can be manipulated much easier than protein or fats. So, wherever the macros land after that is where they will land. But at the moment, looking at my current laid out diet, my macros seem to be:

    Protein: 42%
    Carbohydrates: 20%
    Fats: 30%

    I know there is like 10% left over that isn't attributed to anything, but these are rough estimates based on my Microsoft excel sheet that I have my diet laid out in, and there are a lot of decimal values that I just rounded off. But either way, that's what it looks like at the moment (roughly) in my deficit.

  28. #28
    Steroidal.com Writer/Mod Dan C's Avatar
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    I am DEFINITELY seeing results quickly on IF!!! For one thing, my midsection is visibly becoming tighter in small amounts each day, I am FAR less bloated (visibly as well as how I feel) compared to the standard 6 meals per day protocol. I am really enjoying training in a fasted state with BCAAs pre-workout due to the less bloated feeling as well. I honestly think I might not go back to 6 meals a day unless i'm bulking and the caloric intake is so high that I can't jam it into 3 meals. I just trained legs and found ZERO problems with energy, ZERO issues with blood glucose levels, ZERO issues with strength loss (strength went up, in fact).

    I just ate my post-workout meal after training legs. The meal was just MASSIVE, and IF really seems to be boosting the metabolism because I feel hot as hell right now! My body is burning up! There is a significant body temperature increase right now compared to before I started eating, holy jeez! Can't wait to do my weigh-in and bodyfat check. 2 days to go until then.

  29. #29
    Founding Member OdinsOtherSon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Dan C View Post
    I am DEFINITELY seeing results quickly on IF!!! For one thing, my midsection is visibly becoming tighter in small amounts each day, I am FAR less bloated (visibly as well as how I feel) compared to the standard 6 meals per day protocol. I am really enjoying training in a fasted state with BCAAs pre-workout due to the less bloated feeling as well. I honestly think I might not go back to 6 meals a day unless i'm bulking and the caloric intake is so high that I can't jam it into 3 meals. I just trained legs and found ZERO problems with energy, ZERO issues with blood glucose levels, ZERO issues with strength loss (strength went up, in fact).

    I just ate my post-workout meal after training legs. The meal was just MASSIVE, and IF really seems to be boosting the metabolism because I feel hot as hell right now! My body is burning up! There is a significant body temperature increase right now compared to before I started eating, holy jeez! Can't wait to do my weigh-in and bodyfat check. 2 days to go until then.
    These have been my observations whilst practicing IF as well. One lesson I've learned, and continue to learn, regarding this lifestyle (and IF is a lifestyle....not a diet) one had better stay on track when you DO eat, and keep, have and eat the RIGHT stuff. Veering off track just a little, at least in my experience, can lead to disastrous consequences in food choices. Prior Planning Prevents Piss Poor Performance. However, I'm a huge fan of IF. The whole "catabolism after a couple hours of not eating" philosophy needs to go the way of the dinosaurs.

  30. #30
    Steroidal.com Writer/Mod Dan C's Avatar
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    Well, well... it's been 1 day shy of a full week on intermittent fasting.

    Last Thursday April 18, 2013:
    Weight: 198.4 lbs.
    13.8% bodyfat (handheld monitor)

    Today, Thursday April 25, 2013:
    Weight: 193.8
    12.1% bodyfat (handheld monitor)

    Those numbers don't lie, and I can visibly see it too. Every single day that passes by, I see small amounts of fat loss. 4.6 lbs. and 1.7% loss in body fat after 1 week of IF... that's pretty impressive.

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